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  Topic: WE NEED TO REVIVE REIGN!!!!
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NightShade



Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Posts: 481

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EdgarGrimfang wrote:
The obstacle we face now isn't a matter of wiping the server, or us not being up to date, it's a matter of finding people who still actively WANT to play Ragnarok. Sad to say, but RO is a REALLY old game, the interest in Ragnarok simply is not there like it was in the old days. Everyone now is interested in things like LoL, Guild Wars, and things of that sort.

To put it simply...






Ragnarok simply doesn't hold the same online relevance as it once did.





I've had this conversation with Luzz, how to boost numbers, and that was the major talking point.

A suggestion I think that could be implemented if anything, to make everyone happy is to run a secondary server. If I recall correctly, the hardware Reign runs on could more than easily handle running a second server.

We keep this server as is, and the second one would be the fresh start everyone is looking for. Oldies and such could keep their accounts and such on the current server as a sort of nostalgic thing, and new and old players alike could experience a new beginning on the new server.

That way, those who want the wipe get what they want, and those who want to hold onto their memories and past can do so. I'd say it's a pretty fair compromise, and one that doesn't step on anyone's toes.

One more point however, and its one that others have brought up before, it does inevitably boil down to Luzz's choice.

Does he even want to continue this server?
Does he even have the time to invest in working on this server?
Does he even want to save it?

I know Luzz to be one who doesn't do things the easy way, he does things the right way. He's not one to act rashly or impulsively and we all know it.


Just because a game is old, doesn't always mean that the game is lacking in quality. Sure Ragnarok may not seem like it once was for you, but that isn't the case for everyone else.

Lets take a look at some old online games and see if people still play them -

Diablo 2: LoD - Yep.

World of Warcraft - Yep.

Ragnarok - Pretty damn sure on other servers.

Starcraft: BW - Yep.

Runescape - Probably. <- (I wouldn't know since I never played the game, but going on a hunch.)

I could go on to list many other old games, some which have been replaced by newer releases of the same title, but still hold a decent amount of active players. (Take a look at the CoD series, Gears of War series, Halo series, etc. as prime examples). I would also like to mention that a newer game doesn't always mean that they are better than their previous counterpart, case and point being Diablo 3.

My belief concerning this servers "demise" if you will, is the lack of updates - crucial ones at that, too much babysitting of players when arguments come about, and not making changes in consideration to the amount of active players online for certain events - such as WoE. I mean seriously, all castles are open in WoE with maybe 50-80~ people actively participating? If my memory serves me right, it was two maps, ten castles together and not enough people to have an ACTUAL WoE. I remember half of the time sitting in a castle waiting for a battle.

A little food for thought.
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Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:09 pm
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EdgarGrimfang



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NightShade wrote:
EdgarGrimfang wrote:
The obstacle we face now isn't a matter of wiping the server, or us not being up to date, it's a matter of finding people who still actively WANT to play Ragnarok. Sad to say, but RO is a REALLY old game, the interest in Ragnarok simply is not there like it was in the old days. Everyone now is interested in things like LoL, Guild Wars, and things of that sort.

To put it simply...






Ragnarok simply doesn't hold the same online relevance as it once did.





I've had this conversation with Luzz, how to boost numbers, and that was the major talking point.

A suggestion I think that could be implemented if anything, to make everyone happy is to run a secondary server. If I recall correctly, the hardware Reign runs on could more than easily handle running a second server.

We keep this server as is, and the second one would be the fresh start everyone is looking for. Oldies and such could keep their accounts and such on the current server as a sort of nostalgic thing, and new and old players alike could experience a new beginning on the new server.

That way, those who want the wipe get what they want, and those who want to hold onto their memories and past can do so. I'd say it's a pretty fair compromise, and one that doesn't step on anyone's toes.

One more point however, and its one that others have brought up before, it does inevitably boil down to Luzz's choice.

Does he even want to continue this server?
Does he even have the time to invest in working on this server?
Does he even want to save it?

I know Luzz to be one who doesn't do things the easy way, he does things the right way. He's not one to act rashly or impulsively and we all know it.


Just because a game is old, doesn't always mean that the game is lacking in quality. Sure Ragnarok may not seem like it once was for you, but that isn't the case for everyone else.

Lets take a look at some old online games and see if people still play them -

Diablo 2: LoD - Yep.

World of Warcraft - Yep.

Ragnarok - Pretty damn sure on other servers.

Starcraft: BW - Yep.

Runescape - Probably. <- (I wouldn't know since I never played the game, but going on a hunch.)

I could go on to list many other old games, some which have been replaced by newer releases of the same title, but still hold a decent amount of active players. (Take a look at the CoD series, Gears of War series, Halo series, etc. as prime examples). I would also like to mention that a newer game doesn't always mean that they are better than their previous counterpart, case and point being Diablo 3.

My belief concerning this servers "demise" if you will, is the lack of updates - crucial ones at that, too much babysitting of players when arguments come about, and not making changes in consideration to the amount of active players online for certain events - such as WoE. I mean seriously, all castles are open in WoE with maybe 50-80~ people actively participating? If my memory serves me right, it was two maps, ten castles together and not enough people to have an ACTUAL WoE. I remember half of the time sitting in a castle waiting for a battle.

A little food for thought.


You mistakenly take me calling Ragnarok old, as me calling it bad. I still very much enjoy Ragnarok, I'm saying in general, the game doesn't hold the same relevance it once did. There will always be those who hold onto the older games, be it for the sake of nostalgia or otherwise, but it's slowly being buried underneath other games, that's just how it goes. Never once did I say I no longer enjoy Reign, or Ragnarok, so please, do not place words in my mouth. The games I mentioned, I grabbed out of what I've actively seen people talking about, be it by word of mouth, online forums, and just by running my business.

I run a gaming store/internet cafe now, people come in, rent out one of my computers, and they IMMEDIATELY go to the games I mentioned. So I'm experiencing this first hand. I have Ragnarok installed on these computers, no one I've seen has even logged in on it once. I even have rules for people who want to install games not currently on these computers, and not once have I found a private RO server put on any of this. If anything I've seen private WoW servers and LoL on almost every machine.

I'm saying Ragnarok as a whole, the game in general isn't as popular as it once was, and I think that's a very fair and reasonable point. Even the "big" Ragnarok servers aren't pulling the numbers they once did, a decline is being felt all over, we're just feeling its effects more so due to our already small population. Hell, even the official servers are feeling the decline, and now with Ragnarok 2 being out, well...I mean it's just progression. A new generation of gamers are growing up, getting into MMO's and such, and they are not going to Ragnarok but I digress.

All things considered however, I stand by my original idea to fix this problem. A secondary server, with this current server kept as is, as a means for satisfying both parties.
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Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:11 pm
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Bubbaknoxz



Joined: 11 Sep 2009
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***********Disclaimer I am not advertising for these servers listed below, just needed the numbers**************

If the game doesn't hold the same relevance as it once did then why am I seeing servers with 300+ players on? Just a quick look at some servers

Intense RO - 178
Divinity RO - 284
Woon RO - 326
Gathering RO - 352
Rebirth RO - 1341

That's a quick look at midrates and they all list their players online. You know what Reign says? 46 characters online 90% of them are vendors.

If I were to look at 99/70 servers the numbers are even higher. In fact here you go quick look using RMS.

Epic - 112
Resurgence - 192
Cookie - 352
Talon RO - 1149

The game still has players in it, but the backwards thinking of some of the members on here is baffling. You would much rather let the server stay as is and die than do ANYTHING to give it new breathe?

Running 2 servers cost money you do understand that right? I remember when I was running a RO server it cost me $100+ a month for one server if I wanted 2 I would have had to pay about $150. Limit on the amount of players bandwidth online was 200 for those prices. At the end of the day you have to remember running a server is like running a business when the players stop coming the server will close. Nostalgia doesn't put asses in the game or pay the server cost. That's what you are missing with this argument. Physical money is being used here, not imaginary, if Luzz is fine with that then so be it. I just think he should look at ways to build a better RO experience to attract players rather than lose them.
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Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:51 am
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yoh



Joined: 13 Feb 2010
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Bubbaknoxz wrote:
***********Disclaimer I am not advertising for these servers listed below, just needed the numbers**************

If the game doesn't hold the same relevance as it once did then why am I seeing servers with 300+ players on? Just a quick look at some servers

Intense RO - 178
Divinity RO - 284
Woon RO - 326
Gathering RO - 352
Rebirth RO - 1341

That's a quick look at midrates and they all list their players online. You know what Reign says? 46 characters online 90% of them are vendors.

If I were to look at 99/70 servers the numbers are even higher. In fact here you go quick look using RMS.

Epic - 112
Resurgence - 192
Cookie - 352
Talon RO - 1149

The game still has players in it, but the backwards thinking of some of the members on here is baffling. You would much rather let the server stay as is and die than do ANYTHING to give it new breathe?

Running 2 servers cost money you do understand that right? I remember when I was running a RO server it cost me $100+ a month for one server if I wanted 2 I would have had to pay about $150. Limit on the amount of players bandwidth online was 200 for those prices. At the end of the day you have to remember running a server is like running a business when the players stop coming the server will close. Nostalgia doesn't put asses in the game or pay the server cost. That's what you are missing with this argument. Physical money is being used here, not imaginary, if Luzz is fine with that then so be it. I just think he should look at ways to build a better RO experience to attract players rather than lose them.


Firstly, unless you have done extensive research of the servers you listed, numbers mean little because you do not know the % of A.F.K. merchants like here on Reign.

Second, the discussion of a possible server reset, I am against it at the moment because there are always other options and a reset should be the LAST RESORT. Also because of third point.

Third, the fact most people seem to be skipping over or just not even taking into account is that I am streaming anytime I am online, and although slowly I am getting more people to join. The reason its going slowly is because I do not have many viewers yet, due to the fact i only recently started streaming.

Forth, I would say all discussions about this should either stop for at least a while as so any and all facts can be gathered
Wed Mar 13, 2013 6:10 am
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EdgarGrimfang



Joined: 07 Mar 2010
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Bubbaknoxz wrote:
***********Disclaimer I am not advertising for these servers listed below, just needed the numbers**************

If the game doesn't hold the same relevance as it once did then why am I seeing servers with 300+ players on? Just a quick look at some servers

Intense RO - 178
Divinity RO - 284
Woon RO - 326
Gathering RO - 352
Rebirth RO - 1341

That's a quick look at midrates and they all list their players online. You know what Reign says? 46 characters online 90% of them are vendors.

If I were to look at 99/70 servers the numbers are even higher. In fact here you go quick look using RMS.

Epic - 112
Resurgence - 192
Cookie - 352
Talon RO - 1149

The game still has players in it, but the backwards thinking of some of the members on here is baffling. You would much rather let the server stay as is and die than do ANYTHING to give it new breathe?

Running 2 servers cost money you do understand that right? I remember when I was running a RO server it cost me $100+ a month for one server if I wanted 2 I would have had to pay about $150. Limit on the amount of players bandwidth online was 200 for those prices. At the end of the day you have to remember running a server is like running a business when the players stop coming the server will close. Nostalgia doesn't put asses in the game or pay the server cost. That's what you are missing with this argument. Physical money is being used here, not imaginary, if Luzz is fine with that then so be it. I just think he should look at ways to build a better RO experience to attract players rather than lose them.



As I recall correctly, Luzz actually owns the server hardware, so I really don't think it'd cost him much of anything, because to be fair, if it did, I don't think he'd have kept Reign running as long as he has when it realistically can't be making him any money. In my last statement, I did mention there is possibility for exceptions, and you listed them for me.

A point Yoh made that has weight, how many of those are @autotrade vendors? Vendors tend to weight out actual players on just about any Ragnarok server I've been on. Another thing said was that yeah, a server wipe should be a last resort. There are always other methods to save something than just pull the plug and start over. Yoh's stream has had visible results, I've met the people he's brought over.
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Wed Mar 13, 2013 11:45 am
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NightShade



Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Posts: 481

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EdgarGrimfang wrote:
Bubbaknoxz wrote:
***********Disclaimer I am not advertising for these servers listed below, just needed the numbers**************

If the game doesn't hold the same relevance as it once did then why am I seeing servers with 300+ players on? Just a quick look at some servers

Intense RO - 178
Divinity RO - 284
Woon RO - 326
Gathering RO - 352
Rebirth RO - 1341

That's a quick look at midrates and they all list their players online. You know what Reign says? 46 characters online 90% of them are vendors.

If I were to look at 99/70 servers the numbers are even higher. In fact here you go quick look using RMS.

Epic - 112
Resurgence - 192
Cookie - 352
Talon RO - 1149

The game still has players in it, but the backwards thinking of some of the members on here is baffling. You would much rather let the server stay as is and die than do ANYTHING to give it new breathe?

Running 2 servers cost money you do understand that right? I remember when I was running a RO server it cost me $100+ a month for one server if I wanted 2 I would have had to pay about $150. Limit on the amount of players bandwidth online was 200 for those prices. At the end of the day you have to remember running a server is like running a business when the players stop coming the server will close. Nostalgia doesn't put asses in the game or pay the server cost. That's what you are missing with this argument. Physical money is being used here, not imaginary, if Luzz is fine with that then so be it. I just think he should look at ways to build a better RO experience to attract players rather than lose them.



As I recall correctly, Luzz actually owns the server hardware, so I really don't think it'd cost him much of anything, because to be fair, if it did, I don't think he'd have kept Reign running as long as he has when it realistically can't be making him any money. In my last statement, I did mention there is possibility for exceptions, and you listed them for me.

A point Yoh made that has weight, how many of those are @autotrade vendors? Vendors tend to weight out actual players on just about any Ragnarok server I've been on. Another thing said was that yeah, a server wipe should be a last resort. There are always other methods to save something than just pull the plug and start over. Yoh's stream has had visible results, I've met the people he's brought over.


Each of the servers that Bubba has listed has over 100+ players, even if they were to have Autotrade merchants, that is still better numbers than we have here. I honestly doubt that a server holding 300+ players equals majority of them are autotrading.. I would assume that the servers holding between 100-400 would have quite a few vendors depending on if they have the @command in the first place. However, no where near the ratio that Reign has.

I would also like to mention, if you didn't know this already - Reign/Rain has never wiped before. Every major private RO server that I've been on has wiped atleast once, and the players came right back. So do take into consideration that if lets say all these new players come in, whats there to say that they won't leave if the old players come back and kill them all the time?

This will be my last post regarding this topic, after having this conversation it's become apparent that I've been wasting my time on this server/forums, once again.

Enjoy your 5-10 active players to 30+ @Autotrade merchants.
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Wed Mar 13, 2013 5:57 pm
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Kiku-Ichiomonjii



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I still say that it's at least worth a shot. I'm mean how bad is it going to hurt? really? Let's say some players get mad and quit. 5 players down to 3. Big whoop lol. And that guys channel will be alright. It's not like the server is changing in the core
Wed Mar 13, 2013 6:34 pm
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Bubbaknoxz



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One of you just started streaming.... A day late and a dollar short as a bunch of players already left and you assume that will work? A person will log in take a look at how dead the place is and leave. Streaming isn't going to do shit to bring players here, especially when they SEE nothing exciting on your stream. Better get old players on to make it look active while you're streaming....... :facepalm:

You seriously assume that a server with 300+ players are all vendors? Do you honestly think you can win this argument by countering with that? Am I going to download every single server to test out that argument, no as I don't see the reason to. However I will go off experience of being in over 40 RO servers and knowing how the Player Online info shows dead or dying servers.

Have you ever seen a large server? I am talking 250+ players. You will always have merchants, but the odds of them being 95% of the server as they are on here is minimal at best. The only 2 I've listed that may even come close to that are Epic and Intense due to the number of players active being less than 150. Though one is a low rate so it may just be all active.

However I will say for one server, the @autotrade command is a donation command. The server with it is Rebirth RO who happened to be the largest one out of the group listed above.

Now back to Luzz server hardware argument, how much has Luzz gotten in donations? He could be the type of person who dedicates the money received from donations to actually run the server and not pocket it like other server owners. Or he is running it off a stand alone computer at home and it pretty much is a few inches away from closing.

If you would like to bring up another bullshit rebuttle feel free. I have yet to see any ideas from anyone who has said no as to how the server needs to proceed. Other than "Leave it alone, my poor char is powerful now.... NOOOOO!!!!" Maybe another year of this will get you to realize a total revamping of Reign will be needed to get people on, and by that time it will be too late.

Now I remember why I left, change will never happen on this server. The server went from 60 active to 7 in a few years and people still think doing nothing is the best option. BRAVO!
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EdgarGrimfang



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Bubbaknoxz wrote:
One of you just started streaming.... A day late and a dollar short as a bunch of players already left and you assume that will work? A person will log in take a look at how dead the place is and leave. Streaming isn't going to do shit to bring players here, especially when they SEE nothing exciting on your stream. Better get old players on to make it look active while you're streaming....... :facepalm:

You seriously assume that a server with 300+ players are all vendors? Do you honestly think you can win this argument by countering with that? Am I going to download every single server to test out that argument, no as I don't see the reason to. However I will go off experience of being in over 40 RO servers and knowing how the Player Online info shows dead or dying servers.

Have you ever seen a large server? I am talking 250+ players. You will always have merchants, but the odds of them being 95% of the server as they are on here is minimal at best. The only 2 I've listed that may even come close to that are Epic and Intense due to the number of players active being less than 150. Though one is a low rate so it may just be all active.

However I will say for one server, the @autotrade command is a donation command. The server with it is Rebirth RO who happened to be the largest one out of the group listed above.

Now back to Luzz server hardware argument, how much has Luzz gotten in donations? He could be the type of person who dedicates the money received from donations to actually run the server and not pocket it like other server owners. Or he is running it off a stand alone computer at home and it pretty much is a few inches away from closing.

If you would like to bring up another bullshit rebuttle feel free. I have yet to see any ideas from anyone who has said no as to how the server needs to proceed. Other than "Leave it alone, my poor char is powerful now.... NOOOOO!!!!" Maybe another year of this will get you to realize a total revamping of Reign will be needed to get people on, and by that time it will be too late.

Now I remember why I left, change will never happen on this server. The server went from 60 active to 7 in a few years and people still think doing nothing is the best option. BRAVO!


You've yet to offer any actual solution other than WIPE WIPE WIPE WIPE WIPE. Server wipes do not always work, and you, a so called "veteran" should know that. You can take the petty path, call my solutions bullshit all you want, I'm at least trying to come up with ideas, and means to prevent a wipe as are others who are constructively contributing to this discussion.

Somehow though, I wasn't surprised by your answer. Typical Bubba. Hold your breath until you turn blue, stomp your feet, throw a tantrum and call everyone else names when you don't get your way. Remember the last two times you got your way? Remember that? I do. So don't even joke about there being no change on Reign.

You try to pull off this "hard ass" veteran act, and for what? Part of me wonders if you just want this change for the sake of getting your way. All you ever do is gripe, piss, and moan about the server, the people on the server, and how it's run, so what are you still doing here? You've said it many times, both in game, and on the forums there are so many "better" servers to go to, so what the hell are you still doing here?

Please point out at least one time where I said other servers are specifically 95% merchants, because clearly you and I are reading two different things. I stated that all servers do indeed have a grand majority of merchants running. People using alt accounts to run merchants on servers without @autotrade, or people actually shelling out the cash for the @autotrade command.

I to have been on large servers Bubba, you're not the only one, so get off your high horse. Now, if you've been paying attention you'll see other solutions have been offered to circumvent a wipe, but all you seem to want to do is point fingers and call names without offering any legitimate solutions at all.






We want to revive Reign, not wipe it.





It is the subject of this thread after all, and even then what would wiping the server do Bubba? Please enlighten me, you shout for a wipe so damned hard but fail to offer any evidence to support as to how a wipe would indeed promote growth. Nothing isn't going to grow from nothing, that's simply not how it works. We need to promote the server, vote it up, get it higher in the listings, advertise.

Lets say we do wipe it, lets say we wipe it and...all the current players lose all their stuff, characters, guilds, etc...What motivation would there be for the oldies to return? With the old players gone, well...how on earth would new players come in?

I suppose it's unfair/inaccurate to say all the old players would quit, I'm sure a few would stick around, but then what? We magically update to 3rd classes and all the other official server updates and bing bang boom it's all fixed?

No. Absolutely not. Because no one still would know about Reign Online.

We need to get everyone on board with this, get everyone on RMS, write reviews, to tell their friends, coworkers, whoever they can. We need to stop squabbling here on a predominantly dead forum over whose E-penis is bigger, and whose been around longer and whose higher up in the pecking order. The few remaining old players need to work together constructively, have actual discussion going on other than this digital mud slinging contest.

We need to let the old players who left know, their server is still here. It's still here and it needs them to work together, to lift it up and show everyone else how damned awesome it is. We have a reasonable, and well thought out admin who I'm sure would be more than happy to assist in any advertisements. After all, he supplied me with the Reign Installer DVDs that I handed out at the conventions a few years ago, so if we network this, work together, something big can happen.

Now...

I'm going to ask nicely, lets stop with the cutting down of each other's ideas, lets not let personal grudges get in the way of sound discussion. I've made no attacks on anyone here, that's not the purpose of this thread, nor my posts, the purpose here is to come up with a means to revive Reign, and it'd be for the benefit of us all if this discussion could stay on the topic of such.
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Wed Mar 13, 2013 10:01 pm
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Bubbaknoxz



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Want to know the reason why I like this server? Because when I was on here this place had an active Admin who used to listen to people and I would like to see this server return to glory. If I wanted to go to another server I would, but I trust this Admin more than others.

I've done more suggestions in my time here than a lot of people. Hell I even helped find new sprites for donates the last time they were updated. You like that sword you run around with right? Guess where that came from. The random essences for WOE, guess who helped with the coding for that? I did. So don't try to tell me what I have or have not done for the server. Lets dig a little deeper though so you can understand something you incompetent fool.

It's time for a wipe and a fresh start. You can't have a server that is outdated compete against newer servers. Another reason for the wipe is to allow the new classes to be implemented. They have been out for a few years now and STILL aren't in Reign. If they are implemented now as it currently sits people will have to delete their chars because of the 255 level unable to reborn aspect. Might as well save the time wipe the server and allow proper leveling to take effect. Branch the server out and make it complete.

Now for your arrogant replies to this thread, what have you offered to this server other than bitching at every little thing? So far I have seen nothing from you. You want to talk about me and say "typical Bubba" I don't need to tantrum but apparently you think I do. I did my fact checking I have yet to see you do any fact checking other than saying the old adage "RO is old and unpopular now". I rebuttled your argument with other servers and their numbers. Jay also rebuttled with old games that are still quite popular. But you run a "Internet Cafe" so you think you know shit when apparently you don't have a clue about ****. What is your sample size 20 people? I'm using the internet for my sample size which trumps your 20 people. Data, data, data, you need data to come with a proper argument.

The age of a game doesn't determine popularity. UPDATING the game determines popularity and longevity. Diablo Ladder does wipes every 6 months to a year to keep things fresh; Starcraft released updates and packs to keep things fresh, WoW the same thing. RO has updates but if the server owner doesn't implement them the game will become stale and DIE.

Now if wipes don't work than why was Diablo II so successful? Or other servers. Hell my old server is on its 3rd or 4th wipe I think since I was banned there, and people are still playing there and that Admin doesn't even give a **** about his players, he does it for the weed money. How does that work.

I am the one who said this server has 95% merchants on here. You implied the servers I listed above probably had "vendor outweighing actual players". Therefore you were saying there is more vendors than people online in those servers. I then replied with one instance in which the server has over 1300 players and they have to donate to use @autotrade which cost Euro's to buy. Just another instance of where you don't know shit about ****.

Arguments should be about facts not assumptions, and all of the arguments you have given as to why we shouldn't have a wipe lack facts or data. You're only thing is "People will leave" guess what people already left, where the **** have you been?
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EdgarGrimfang



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Bubbaknoxz wrote:
Want to know the reason why I like this server? Because when I was on here this place had an active Admin who used to listen to people and I would like to see this server return to glory. If I wanted to go to another server I would, but I trust this Admin more than others.

I've done more suggestions in my time here than a lot of people. Hell I even helped find new sprites for donates the last time they were updated. You like that sword you run around with right? Guess where that came from. The random essences for WOE, guess who helped with the coding for that? I did. So don't try to tell me what I have or have not done for the server. Lets dig a little deeper though so you can understand something you incompetent fool.

It's time for a wipe and a fresh start. You can't have a server that is outdated compete against newer servers. Another reason for the wipe is to allow the new classes to be implemented. They have been out for a few years now and STILL aren't in Reign. If they are implemented now as it currently sits people will have to delete their chars because of the 255 level unable to reborn aspect. Might as well save the time wipe the server and allow proper leveling to take effect. Branch the server out and make it complete.

Now for your arrogant replies to this thread, what have you offered to this server other than bitching at every little thing? So far I have seen nothing from you. You want to talk about me and say "typical Bubba" I don't need to tantrum but apparently you think I do. I did my fact checking I have yet to see you do any fact checking other than saying the old adage "RO is old and unpopular now". I rebuttled your argument with other servers and their numbers. Jay also rebuttled with old games that are still quite popular. But you run a "Internet Cafe" so you think you know shit when apparently you don't have a clue about ****. What is your sample size 20 people? I'm using the internet for my sample size which trumps your 20 people. Data, data, data, you need data to come with a proper argument.

The age of a game doesn't determine popularity. UPDATING the game determines popularity and longevity. Diablo Ladder does wipes every 6 months to a year to keep things fresh; Starcraft released updates and packs to keep things fresh, WoW the same thing. RO has updates but if the server owner doesn't implement them the game will become stale and DIE.

Now if wipes don't work than why was Diablo II so successful? Or other servers. Hell my old server is on its 3rd or 4th wipe I think since I was banned there, and people are still playing there and that Admin doesn't even give a **** about his players, he does it for the weed money. How does that work.

I am the one who said this server has 95% merchants on here. You implied the servers I listed above probably had "vendor outweighing actual players". Therefore you were saying there is more vendors than people online in those servers. I then replied with one instance in which the server has over 1300 players and they have to donate to use @autotrade which cost Euro's to buy. Just another instance of where you don't know shit about ****.

Arguments should be about facts not assumptions, and all of the arguments you have given as to why we shouldn't have a wipe lack facts or data. You're only thing is "People will leave" guess what people already left, where the **** have you been?


There is no arguing with you Bubba, you're always going to say you're right on the virtue of you being you. That's how it is now, that's how it always has been. You'll never see any view other than your own. I think the only clever thing I've seen thus far was Nightshade distancing himself from this discussion any further, and it's something I'm going to follow suit on.

I asked you to lay off the insults, the talking down, and you can't do that. I'd offer to debate your response but where would it get me? More belligerent insults and chest puffing. So until you can find it in yourself to actually consider serious, and civil conversation, I have nothing more to discuss with you.

I've made my arguments, said what I had to say, and I stand by it. Peace.
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Wed Mar 13, 2013 10:58 pm
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Valiant92



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No no no, you all have it wrong.
The answer is simple.
TITS or GTFO.
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Wed Mar 13, 2013 11:48 pm
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NightShade



Joined: 14 Sep 2009
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EdgarGrimfang wrote:
Bubbaknoxz wrote:
Want to know the reason why I like this server? Because when I was on here this place had an active Admin who used to listen to people and I would like to see this server return to glory. If I wanted to go to another server I would, but I trust this Admin more than others.

I've done more suggestions in my time here than a lot of people. Hell I even helped find new sprites for donates the last time they were updated. You like that sword you run around with right? Guess where that came from. The random essences for WOE, guess who helped with the coding for that? I did. So don't try to tell me what I have or have not done for the server. Lets dig a little deeper though so you can understand something you incompetent fool.

It's time for a wipe and a fresh start. You can't have a server that is outdated compete against newer servers. Another reason for the wipe is to allow the new classes to be implemented. They have been out for a few years now and STILL aren't in Reign. If they are implemented now as it currently sits people will have to delete their chars because of the 255 level unable to reborn aspect. Might as well save the time wipe the server and allow proper leveling to take effect. Branch the server out and make it complete.

Now for your arrogant replies to this thread, what have you offered to this server other than bitching at every little thing? So far I have seen nothing from you. You want to talk about me and say "typical Bubba" I don't need to tantrum but apparently you think I do. I did my fact checking I have yet to see you do any fact checking other than saying the old adage "RO is old and unpopular now". I rebuttled your argument with other servers and their numbers. Jay also rebuttled with old games that are still quite popular. But you run a "Internet Cafe" so you think you know shit when apparently you don't have a clue about ****. What is your sample size 20 people? I'm using the internet for my sample size which trumps your 20 people. Data, data, data, you need data to come with a proper argument.

The age of a game doesn't determine popularity. UPDATING the game determines popularity and longevity. Diablo Ladder does wipes every 6 months to a year to keep things fresh; Starcraft released updates and packs to keep things fresh, WoW the same thing. RO has updates but if the server owner doesn't implement them the game will become stale and DIE.

Now if wipes don't work than why was Diablo II so successful? Or other servers. Hell my old server is on its 3rd or 4th wipe I think since I was banned there, and people are still playing there and that Admin doesn't even give a **** about his players, he does it for the weed money. How does that work.

I am the one who said this server has 95% merchants on here. You implied the servers I listed above probably had "vendor outweighing actual players". Therefore you were saying there is more vendors than people online in those servers. I then replied with one instance in which the server has over 1300 players and they have to donate to use @autotrade which cost Euro's to buy. Just another instance of where you don't know shit about ****.

Arguments should be about facts not assumptions, and all of the arguments you have given as to why we shouldn't have a wipe lack facts or data. You're only thing is "People will leave" guess what people already left, where the **** have you been?


There is no arguing with you Bubba, you're always going to say you're right on the virtue of you being you. That's how it is now, that's how it always has been. You'll never see any view other than your own. I think the only clever thing I've seen thus far was Nightshade distancing himself from this discussion any further, and it's something I'm going to follow suit on.

I asked you to lay off the insults, the talking down, and you can't do that. I'd offer to debate your response but where would it get me? More belligerent insults and chest puffing. So until you can find it in yourself to actually consider serious, and civil conversation, I have nothing more to discuss with you.

I've made my arguments, said what I had to say, and I stand by it. Peace.


Actually, there was plenty of insightful ideas from this thread before all the, "No, no no that can't be done!" and subliminal jabs from your "party". By subliminal jabs, I mean by how grudges are still brewing even after 3 years have past.

Quote:
GRANDPA DREADNAUGHT
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 9:46 am Post subject:
Yeah... server wipes ain't gonna be getin' no votes from me. We all know WHY some small groups of people would want a server wipe.

Self serving interests disguised as "trying to do good". Same as ever I see.


^Case and point.

Which is quite sad to be honest, majority of the players that I have fought and raged with are now on possibly good terms for the most part. Good terms being that there's no quick jabs at each other and we're here to solve the problem for the most part.

Now I know I said before I wasn't going to reply again, but I'm not gonna let Bubba get jabbed at like that for redundant reasons when he's giving facts based on searching RMS and checking the active players per server. Like he has mentioned, we gave ideas on how to do a turn around for the server. It's not like wiping the server and we'll get 500+ players instantly, no. It's going to take time and lots of effort to see it through, as well as new additions to the server.

If you will, refresh my memory on how Bubba has gotten his "way". The only thing that I can remember is the work that went into getting the new donation items, such as that sword that "Everyone" loves to wear.

We've been pushing for a new MvP room just about ever since we came back, but that never happened. Also a smaller PvP room, that never happened either. But people get their @ignore such and such and a Social PvP room.

So please, stop trying to act innocent when it's as clear as day that you're throwing quick jabs in your posts at us, then retreating and tossing up a white flag assuming that we are to respond nicely.

Have a nice day.

Now Bubba here since I don't feel like going on my comp or logging in... You never had a chance to win that argument you lack facts, and can't handle someone who is capable of backing up talk with facts. You sling shit and I responded the way you responded on here. You started the debate I won it. Now go cry in a corner. And no I've hardly ever get my way on here, but I always try to give insight or do the leg work to help the server even if its not my idea because it is beneficial to the server.
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Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:24 am
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yoh



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There seem to be a few variable that everyone seems to just want to gloss over at the moment;

Firstly: Yes Bubba, i may be "late" in when i started streaming on reign. However at the time when the server was active i did not have the hardware to stream, also not everyone really cares about 3rd job classes. Case in point being all those whom are now playing on the new-ish "Ragnarok Classic" server so what would be the point of a wipe if most of the potential new people dont even care for the 3rd jobs

Secondly: Does anyone even know the "Success/Failure" rates of the servers that have done wipes, although I don't I highly doubt its even near 80% success

Thirdly: Who cares about past "grudges" in game, we are trying to come up with viable options here to at least attempt to revive Reign WITHOUT having to just go straight into a wipe

Fourthly: Yes most people whom may/have been against the idea of a wipe may be due to them still wanting to keep their stuff, however what about the new players. Yeah they may not have much but some people do not like when a wipe happens when they recently joined, and would likely quit afterwards. Yeah there is the potential for them to come back and for even more people to join, however the potential outcomes are not what should be the main things driving what is chosen/discussed.

Fifthly: I have been on many other servers prior, most of which had at the least 150 ish people online. Yet i can say that at the very least 25% of that was merchants, I do know that its unlikely that those that were used as an example have over 70% however unless actual research is done on them, who really knows? Just looking at numbers and reviews on RMS doesn't always help for 1 main reason. ANYTHING can be posted in a review, thus who knows what could be a potential lie to get more players to join.

Sixth-ly: Even if a wipe is decided upon, what then? No one has really said anything aside from "potential this" or "potential that". If a wipe is decided the the question is "What is next?" If you really want a wipe to happen then what, just do the same thing as always. Argue and bicker with each other here on the forum, what would that accomplish. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING that's what

Seventh-ly: Yeah even if a wipe was decided upon, I likely would still stream on the server. Though reason I'm against the wipe is not because I don't want to loose my shit, I could care less about my shit I can always get it back. The reason I'm against it now is because NO ONE has yet to think ahead, what if all the wipe does is make it "worse"? Yeah few people may be on but then what, a "slow growth" with what possible "guarantee"? I have yet to see any "facts" that a wipe is "the only answer" so just STOP PRETENDING IT IS
Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:47 am
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GRANDPA DREADNAUGHT



Joined: 30 Mar 2010
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My legacy still lives I see. Never change Reign, never change.
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EdgarGrimfang wrote:

Because that good sir, would make sense, and thus defuse the entire argument.

EdgarGrimfang wrote:
Remember kids, Cigarettes are alot like hamsters. Utterly harmless to have until placed into your mouth, and lit on fire.
Don't smoke hamsters kids.
Thu Mar 14, 2013 4:18 am
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